Tube amps with a SS preamp?

[Old Guy]

Agnostic = sitting on the fence. That is fine until you get a better understanding of a topic.

BULLSHIT

Means show me proof and I'll agree.
I have heard a LOT of amps. I have at least as good an understanding as you, and frankly am certain I've heard more amps. For me it has to be in the thousands. I built my first tube am in 1963.


The difference between us? I'm not gonna claim you don't understand something. Other than word meanings...

As far as rants and raves about amps much of it is opinion. I don't consider anybody's opinion a fact. I do not feel the ultimate amp was built 50 years ago, I think it has yet to be built...

But all of us can learn more...
As far as connectors, it does not present a compatibility problem for a knowledgeable person. The signal FEEDING those connectors is what matters.

I spent over 40 years interfacing gear, in studios and live. There is a right way to interface anything, sometimes more than one right way. Do it wrong and not know how to fix it, you could think it is incompatibility. There is much less incompatibility and much more lack of knowledge than you seem to think.

[LowOhms]

I use a SS pre with tubes on my 19s and 604s as well. I also use an Oppo player and a turntable.
Depending on what type of music you listen to, how big your room is and how loud you listen, 2A3 may or may not be the answer. I have a moderate sized room and 3 watts isn't quite there for heavy rock on the 19s. For jazz and smaller classical, a 2A3 amp is ideal. Even if you don't often listen at elevated volumes, when you want to you'll regret not having the juice. A beefier tube amp can really work with model 19s.
That said, a 2A3 amp does sound better than most SS amps I've heard within it's limitations.

Hi Zelgall,

Your comments, based on direct experience, are quite valid and worthwhile to the original poster's query. Nice job.

We need to remember, the OP uses 19s and K-Horns also, with the K-Horns being very efficient.

When I was discussing a 2A3 amp, I was not suggesting use of an "average" 2A3 SE amp at all. Rather, I was only suggesting one that has been optimized as to its power supply design and internal wiring, so as to achieve high transfer efficiency and highly dynamic contrasting of the music.

I only mentioned ONE commercial choice as being suitable, and you know, from knowing me, what amps those would be. I have heard them extensively mostly on GPA 604s in a variety of private homes and venues. It NEVER left me wanting for more power. BUT, that design by Dennis Fraker of Serious Stereo is the one true exception, of course.

The ONLY other 2A3 alternative "I" perhaps could live with might be one of my own executions. If the original poster decides to roll his own, I'd steer him to build something worthy, as well as I can. I did so for the Brit who wrote-up the SE DC Type 45 amp he just finished. From the Brit's commentary, it hardly seems like a typical amplifier at all !! Of course, it isn't. He loves it !!

I can totally understand your comments, I agree with you, and I do not deny that you hear and report things quite well. But understand this Zelgall, I am talking about a different animal, and, like you, my reporting is accurate also.

Wish you were close by in the MidWest so you could personally hear the 1.4 Watter I am presently developing, on ALTEC drivers. Its lotsa work !!

Like you, I employ a solid state RIAA preamp and a solid state CD Player.

Jeff Medwin

[zelgall]

Hi Zelgall,

I only mentioned ONE commercial choice as being suitable, and you know, from knowing me, what amps those would be. I have heard them extensively mostly on GPA 604s in a variety of private homes and venues. It NEVER left me wanting for more power. BUT, that design by Dennis Fraker of Serious Stereo is the one true exception, of course.

Jeff Medwin

Hi Jeff.
I understand that you're enamored by Mr. Fraker's amps but even if they were the best amps to use with a 604 doesn't necessarily mean they will be the correct amp with all speakers.
I have 604-8Gs and I do like 2A3s for them but the Model 19 is a different speaker and I believe it really does benefit from more power. Maybe PP 2A3s would be interesting. I have some appropriate iron and enough 2A3s to try it so maybe in the near future...
Kyle.

[mah]

OG, 'sitting on the fence' was used in the sense of being neither for or against something until there was proof available, that could be understood, to enable a change of mindset.

No offense(offence) was intended.

My reference to different connectors stands, as a sign of possible circuit comptability differences. The fact that one can do a 'fix' does not change the fact that the equipment has different interface Standards. After encountering such issues with my audio system I tried various Pro Audio 'fixes' and solved most of the problems(not every one can do this).
I still cannot connect my video player/recorder(rca) to my audio system(rca) because I get excessive hum. I am capable of tracking down the cause of this problem and dealing with it but at present I have things to do that better deserve my time.


P.S. The definition of the word 'agnostic' ties it to consideration of the existence or otherwise of a deity(s).

[Old Guy]

P.S. The definition of the word 'agnostic' ties it to consideration of the existence or otherwise of a deity(s).

Re-read some of the am descriptions in this thread, and my allusions to religion will be more understandable. It seems some worship certain amps.

Sitting on a fence indicates an inability to make a decision, an issue I do not have.

I have made a decision not to own SET's for instance. Why? Even with the most efficient speakers available, SET cannot achieve anything like the original presentation of classical pieces. That is only the first reason.


You said:
"Agnostic = sitting on the fence. That is fine until you get a better understanding of a topic."

I don't see how I could not take offense at that, with an implied inability to decide, and not even implied lack of understanding of the issue.

Regardless it's water over the dam. Let's move on.

Some love SET, some of us won't use them. It would be a damn boring world if all women were brunettes and vanilla was the only flavor of ice cream.

[LowOhms]

Hi Jeff.
I understand that you're enamored by Mr. Fraker's amps but even if they were the best amps to use with a 604 doesn't necessarily mean they will be the correct amp with all speakers.
I have 604-8Gs and I do like 2A3s for them but the Model 19 is a different speaker and I believe it really does benefit from more power. Maybe PP 2A3s would be interesting. I have some appropriate iron and enough 2A3s to try it so maybe in the near future...
Kyle.

Hello Zelgall / Kyle !!

I recently had a chance to hear at my home an amp Dr. Art Loesch built in the 1970s, P-P two stage, DC coupled. It was a 12AX7 as a diff amp, with a CCS on its common cathode tail, plates DC coupled to 6AH4GT Finals, a lovely sounding tube in the Finals position. ( TV vertical deflection triode, mu of 8 as I recall. ) Many on A.A. like it as a preamp tube, and it has a beautiful top end !!

I would say, if building P-P specifically for Model 19s, THAT specific P-P topology would be the best possible to employ. I would be happy to privately mail you a set of schematics, and a re-do I did with more conservative operating points.

As for me, my preference is good SE over good P-P, and I also personally prefer a A-7, with partial woofer horn loading, over a Model 19. Just what "I" like the most now. Regards,

Jeff Medwin

[tomt]

2A3

perhaps you should qualify that.

'single plate 2a3' ...


j/k

[LowOhms]

perhaps you should qualify that.

'single plate 2a3' ...


j/k

Sure !! Current production :

Budget : Can't beat a JJ 2A3-40 .

Upscale : EML mesh plate

and yes, both are single plates, both also have symmetrical filament structures.

Jeff

[mah]

It is not good form to refer to a PM content in the open forum. Because OG has done this I feel that I can reveal what I said in my PM to OG.

The message was: "OG, what the heck is going on here?"

-nothing more, nothing less.